Dani Moseley & babirye bukilwa on Dreaming Whilst Black: “We’re not a monolith”
If you don’t know Dreaming Whilst Black, then get to know. The show tells the story of a young, passionate (yet naïve) filmmaker, Kwabena, who struggles to navigate between his dreams and reality, full of funny moments, and very real relatable moments. A show that has something to say and (quite literally) reaches people through the screen; we’re living these moments. We see the Black British experience in a way never really seen or explored on UK TV before.
Ahead of Dreaming Whilst Black coming back to our screens as a full series, I got to chat with Dani Moseley (who plays Amy) & babirye bukilwa (who plays Vanessa) in the new series which is now available to watch on BBC iPlayer. We spoke about hair, Black woman are not monoliths (so stop treating us like one), set life and who they’re celebrating.
What was the biggest challenge in the show?
Dani Mosely: The show in the web series or in the TV show.
Stafi: I guess both.
Dani Mosely: I tell you what - when I did the web series, Amy swore a lot, which I kind of liked because I don't swear. So I remember my friend watching and she said, what's going on with you? And I was like, mmmm it’s just a character but it was, you know, fun to play with that. And obviously me and Adjani got to get close, I got to know him better. And then we became friends from the Web series. And so mainly the challenge was obviously we didn't have that much money to do the show. So everything was kind of ad hoc and we had to do what we had to do to make it work for the show. But Adjani and his team were as professional as they could be. Like, I remember watching the premiere for when we did the webseries. I'm sitting there next to my friends and I'm like, this looks good. I had done the web series before and the quality, even though it was good content, the quality of how it looked wasn't as finished as the new series of Dreaming Whilst Black. And I was like, These people know what they’re doing, like it looks really good. The challenge of the TV (series) I mean, the challenge was getting the role and then once I got the role, it was all right. But for me, there wasn't any time just doing the show per say. It was an awesome experience. I'm someone that manifests and I write goals down and I write what I want things to look like and I did back in 2019, I wrote down what I wanted. This was when we hadn’t got the pilot, nothing, and I wrote down what filming would be like for six weeks working on Dreaming Whilst Black nad when it actually happened last year, it was better than I wrote it. It was great.
babirye bukilwa: To be transparent, playing somebody that's attractive. That’s a challenge. Not as in it's like something I don't feel about myself or that it’s particularly hard as an action. It's not. It's more so - and again, just me being honest, being in this industry and being on television for over a decade and understanding how social media has changed and how our relationship to television and media has changed. Just constantly in the back of my mind being like I could be a meme, I could potentially be screenshot and be a meme. I could be screenshot and then be used in an article about dark skinned Black women and their representation on TV. And there's nothing I can do about it. And my face could be used on a list like who's more attractive? Who is less attractive? And that's the challenge I find when you're portraying a love interest for someone because that's like the sole purpose of Vanessa. She, you know, they meet, they fall in love, have a wonderful meet cute. But the show is, you know, it's about Kwabena. So my challenges lied in really wanting to make Vanessa like grounded in a way from Adjani and away from this. The point of her is that she's a romantic person, which I don't think is the point of her. But I'm saying as a person in television or film when you are deemed as somebody that is attractive and has to do things like kiss them on screen. Yeah, it's a different ballgame. And yeah, so in the back of my mind, the biggest challenge was me preempting misogynoir.
What is your favorite line or favorite scenes that you filmed?
Dani Mosely: One of my favorite scenes is with babs because we just vibed and we had like a peak interest in one scene and it was just real. Like it wasn't forced. It was just like best as we were being ourselves, but with each other and also having discussions about stuff that, we've been through and talking about. So in that particular scene, hair gets mentioned and just talking about what we get called like the names that people think or the people that people think we look like just because we’re Black. That we look like we’re Whitney Houston, that we look like Beyonce. It’s like where are we going? How are we getting there? Just things about that and how our hair is.
babirye bukilwa: (chimes in) You look like Erica baduyu. Leave me alone please (laughs)
Stafi: Have you got that?
Babs: Do you not get that?
Stafi: No, I didn't get that (much growing up). Did you? (Internal after thought - I did actually get that a bit growing. It hasn’t happened to me in a while which is why I think I did forget I had a lot of those experiences about my hair from randoms on the street, or in the workplace ect. growing up)
babirye bukilwa: Well, sort of. Even, for example, just today, I've just got a little skirt, no make up, scarf on my head and locs. “Nubian goddess. Nubian goddess! Yes empress with the best”
Stafi: Screaming.
babirye bukilwa: And I’m like mate - (points to ears) Arctic monkeys I’m listening to Artic Monkeys I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'm sorry.
Stafi: I’m screaming! At how black women are seen as a monolith. Like I feel like the way you guys are talking about the show, we get to see the nuances of being a Black woman and how we're all not the same.
Dani Mosely: Yeah, and we've got three representations of black women. We've got the person that wants to be in a long term relationship. Someone married doing the children and husband thing. And then you've got Amy, who is fine being single and just seeing what's out there and just having a go, and if that didn't work? We'll try again. And actually my career is the most important thing. So I think it's important to have that because as you just said, you get one depiction of a black woman, and that's the blanket for everyone. And like, okay, that's what Black Women are like? And no. we're happy. We're sad. We're horny, we’re upset, we're angry, we're shy, we are all these different things and we want different things as Black women. We're fighting for a similar cause, but we're doing it from different angles and coming at it from a different background, whether that be cultural or class or whatever. But yeah, so this show definitely gives the spotlight to those different things.
Did you learn something about yourself?
Dani Mosely: I think I learned that I can be apologetic. I'm still apologetic, I'm still not unapologetic. I think if I'm honest, the Amy that I was Dreaming Whilst Black (web series) was less apologetic than the Amy I am in this one (TV Series) is apologetic. Hopefully she will find herself throughout the process. Yeah, I find that and I find that in myself. Whereas I look at someone like Babs who says their truth, and is you know, willing to do so. And I'm just looking at Babs like, wow! One day. It's yeah, it's, it's difficult. And I don't want to always rock the boat. Sometimes it takes me to get to a point where I just, like, I don't care about the boat anymore, the boat will be fine. I'll find a paddle or something. Whereas I look at someone like Babs and I'm like, They've been doing the paddle themselves and I've gotten used to it. That's what they do. And so I hope to join them at some point too.
BIB: I’m loving the energy right now!
babirye bukilwa: Mate I’m a bit - I’m going to message you later because we don’t have time for this right now. But honestly, no, that was really beautiful -, I’m actually bit of fangirl of you Dani
Dani Mosely: Same! What you talking about, same.
babirye bukilwa: So no, that’s really kind and what I was going to say before that. So that that's why this is a bit overwhelming was - I don't know if I learnt anything about myself but what I gained was a friend and I was going to say that was you Dani. It always depends on the project, doesn’t it? This is not me complaining about any of the other projects I've done before with television but this was Dreaming Whilst Black. It was absolutely purposefully a blackity black show. And the set ups were different, the systems were different. It was what it was because the function of it, the reason why exists, it’s a reslient thing. So just again, I had a PTSD from being on predominantly white sets, which therefore predominantly means - where my work colleagues have majority white - from hair to costume to who's lighting you to who's wherever in you to do this to things that need to who's watching you to the runner, right? And so I'm very used to compartmentalizing parts of myself in order to remain safe and sane on set when I'm working and whenever I saw Dani I felt absolutely free and safe. And I was like, Oh, wow like there are people in this industry that come onto set and are like I feel safe. That’s mad, what’s that like? So I am grateful for the safety because I think the safety I felt with DanI, Adjani and Demmy, I feel like allowed me to have fun. So my favorite scene was the scene that I did with Dani where we talk about hair but because there was already a foundation of safety and understanding, it just meant that we could play, which was nice.
Who is one person you want to celebrate?
Dani Mosely: Wow - there’s so many.
babirye bukilwa: I'd like to celebrate younger babs because that little b!tch, she went through it and I'm like, You know what? Yeah, hold tight, you. I'm like, I'm trying to be as free and as happy and as joyous as you are because you were the foundation of who I am. So honestly, I think - and her name is Vanessa, so younger Vanessa. Like, I'm like, Yeah, like you for me you're like, my hero You deserve all the rounds. And then if it's a person that's outside of my self I would say that debi tucker green, she desrves her flowers and more. And I think she deserves forests, landscapes and the Amazon.
Dani Mosely: People that have inspired me. Angela Bassett, Viola Davis, Oprah, Michelle Obama, Beyonce. Black women, their work ethic, what they do, the fact that they have the opportunity to give life. They don't all do that, but they give lives through the work they do. They give it through the messages they do through their creative practices and how they spearhead things moving forward. I just as much as I believe that I have the spirit that they have, I know looking at them and watching them do what they do spurs me on to continue doing what I do and not wanting to do anything else, and which in turn inspires others to want to do what they want to do by watching what I do. And also Adjani for making this happen because he’s been through it. This has not been an easy process from the web series. And I don't think there would have been another person like him to get this to where it is now. And I've always said that when he told me in the pilot, did you ever do you ever believe that we'd get here? I just said to him, I believed in you. That's the all I had to believe. And and look where we are now. So that man has been through it and continues to go through it, but he's the one jumping it forward and I’m glad he’s getting the accolades going because he deserves it. And not everyone's willing to go where he’s gone.
A tip that you would give to young Black women trying to break the industry as an actor?
Dani Mosely: If you really want a journey to find yourself and find out what you're doing here is - buckle up, because this is not an easy thing to do. I don't think it's for everyone. People want to give it a go, that's absolutely fine but it's tough, it’s rejection, it's hard times, it's lack of money. It's a lot of money. And then lack of money again. It's being in the front and being watched and being judged. And you have to know that this is what you want to do. You've got to want to do this and know that there's nothing else you want to do or want to be a storyteller. Don’t get me wrong there are people that do acting just for the fun of it. That's what they want to do and that’s fine. Just know that you want to do it. And if you want to do if for fun, then know you wanna do it for fun. And if you want to do it as a career, then you can do it and get stuck in because there is no one way of getting into industry. There's so many different ways of getting there. And sometimes you stay there, sometimes you don't. Sometimes you take a break, sometimes you keep at it but know that it’s what you want to do and create a community for yourself to support you, because it's hard. But for me its worth it, but that’s just me.
babirye bukilwa: My advice to any young black girl or person raised as a girl, you know, presents as a girl, presents as a femme that wants to act. I'd say really look to your friends and your community. And I would say find other hobbies that give you just as much joy. And I would say that your value is not in awards. I would say that it is smoke and mirrors like it's not this glamorous lifestyle, you know, And even, you know, people in the Marvel films are not living these glamorous lifestyles. And I would just implore you to look at all the aspects of your life and just remember that acting is like a - it's a job. This job is not your life.
End
it was a real joy talking with both babirye and dani, as well as also attending the screening you could sense a real family and something beautiful has been created. Dreaming Whilst Black airs on BBC Three and BBC iPlayer from Monday 24th July 2023 at 10pm. The series will be available in full as a boxset on BBC iPlayer on 24th July.